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[harriergirl]

*... Timescale wise - As it stands there is work to be done on the community and newbie-friendly aspects of the game and I see this as a priority before pumping money in to advertising, my timescale atm will be this following Christmas - a period I have always found in the past to reap maximum returns for advertising. Admittedly I could in theory "keep improving forever", and keep saying "No point advertising now, I have X or Y feature to come!", but the intention is to do it once we have a system of training allies, the new manual, and the core L/F changes back in place, which is all planned in the coming 3 months.

I'll take any necessary debates up elsewhere so as not to clutter this thread.

Your game will be dead by then, or at least only your really really really really really reallyreally Loyal players will still be around.

your game could be **** but new people would continually try it with the right advertising. to me the shrinking playerbase should be the #1 priority, but maybe you want to get rid of a few of us, who knows.

 

[Azzer]

A few months is very short. Players aren't dwindling that fast. I may alter timescales and bring advertising in ready for the start of the next round to come in though.

 

[harriergirl]

A few months is very short. Players aren't dwindling that fast.

Maybe, as I'm not a registered psychic I won't argue the point.

I may alter timescales and bring advertising in ready for the start of the next round to come in though.

^^ The winner. But I have to wonder why? Is it because I'm right or you want me to stfu?

just curious?

 

[Azzer]

^^ The winner. But I have to wonder why? Is it because I'm right or you want me to stfu?
just curious?

Because you may be right in that - why worry about getting the game to "perfection", when people will always dislike one thing and like another... when we can just worry about getting the numbers in and hoping enough stick around to be worth the investment.

It's a hard call to make - as you say, you're no psychic, and nor am I. Judging whether integrating more newbie friendliness first (aimed at new player retention), then getting the advertising - but having a longer delay (thus seeing playerbase dwindle more than increase), is going to be worse or better than advertising now with a lower retention level... is as much luck/guesswork as anything (unless you're a marketing/advertising/media mogul ofc, and even then I'm sure they'd struggle to be exact ).

 

[Iamsmart]

To be fair you said you were going to run a mass advertisement campaign December/January and you never did Careful about continually delaying - It may just never happen.

 

[Azzer]

To be fair you said you were going to run a mass advertisement campaign December/January and you never did Careful about continually delaying - It may just never happen.

I know. Tis a dangerous game.

I got burned by the powerblock and then continued play of certain alliances seemingly "sucking all of the fun" from the game, and all the complaints, moans, and quits I saw from it, that I thought "Do I really want to bring new players in to *THIS* mess". Risks, everything's a risk. Doing things, not doing things. You'll always have groups of players that hate and love things, groups that don't care. There'll always be things that could be awesome, could be awful, and sometimes you've just got to take the plunge. It's just a question of what you want to risk - money investing in something... the playerbase... angry players... happy players... newbies... oldbies... "ftw" players... casual players... and weighing in to all of this in relation to players, trying to remember that the people shouting the loudest on the forums aren't always the most perfect example of the majority of the players (ie - it's hard to listen to voices that don't speak).

 

[pinpower]

Just as something in the mean time...could you not add in the daily voting thing again? It doesnt even have to give us a reward but it can basically act as free advertising.

If people see us in the top 10 list on a couple of games sites its bound to get a few actually trying the game...

Might as well do everything possible until your ready to push for the big advertising...especially as its free??

 

[Madmeater]

Just as something in the mean time...could you not add in the daily voting thing again? It doesnt even have to give us a reward but it can basically act as free advertising.

If people see us in the top 10 list on a couple of games sites its bound to get a few actually trying the game...

Might as well do everything possible until your ready to push for the big advertising...especially as its free??

I agree, it would get alot of votes too.

Wouldn't hurt if it gave us some seeds though

 

[Leah]

You'll always have groups of players that hate and love things, groups that don't care. There'll always be things that could be awesome, could be awful, and sometimes you've just got to take the plunge.

I cannot speak for other players, but I have enjoyed your game from day one. I'm not one of those that gets so caught up in exact ratios and all the math, and most new players aren't either, especially their first round. I've seen quite a few changes just in the half dozen or so rounds I've played and I've just "rolled with the punches" so to speak. Each change just represented a new thing to try, a new way to play.

As far as retaining the veterans of Bushtarion through changes, I'm not sure what you could possibly do there. People get used to playing a certain way, have certain tactics they like to use, and may not enjoy the game anymore if a change you make alters that for them. You're bound to lose some here and there. But new players don't care so much about it, they haven't played in the past to have anything to compare too. I don't really see a "bad" time to bring in new players. Even with the huge power-block those of us who weren't competing for a high spot were playing the game just like we always have and having a good time of it (and "weren't competing for a high spot" represents the majority of your players each round) and a newbie wouldn't have seen much difference between that round and any other.

Perhaps until you have the training alliances under way you could have a group of volunteers who teach new people how to play and/or answer their questions? Sure there's the options of "ask on forums" or "ask in IRC" but a lot of new people are made to feel dumb when they do that, or don't really get an answer at all. Perhaps if they had one person they could privately message, the same person each time, they would feel more comfortable asking questions and get more reliable answers. I know you have something like this set up with the Official Helper positions but this would make it a tad more personal, bring the new person more into the community right off the bat. It doesn't even have to be super awesome high score people (who frankly often don't have the time or interest to be tutoring someone while trying to play ftw). Just people who spend a reasonable amount of time online, have a grasp of the basic features of the game a new person would need to learn, and are willing to donate a bit of their time helping their particular group of newbies.

It's not a perfect idea, but maybe it could be tweaked a little and that way there would be something in place until the training alliances are up, or for people who don't want to join an alliance right away and would prefer to try out solo but still need a little help and encouragement when it gets frustrating (and it does, often lol).

 

[Dafydd]

It was only a few hours ago on Irc, that I mentioned the size difference from 10 rounds ago. When I last played, full alliancs of 20 took up about 25 ranks or so, now they barely fill the top 10.

While the core may have remained the same, this game doesn't need balances, units changes or anything like that, what it needs to retain the playability, is size. If there is enough players, then mid table, or lower rank play becomes fun because wars at that size become possible. So if your rank 1, and get zeroed, there will still be life in the game at the lower ranks. I'm currently in the rank 7 or so alliance, and I'm struggeling to find someone to talk to on irc - the whole point I came back to play.

For my money, mass advertisement and playerbase increase MUST be your primary focus from here on in Azz-man. Nothing short of that can improve the game. You can uss over unit balancing all you want, but people will not even notice that things need balancing, until such a time as their hooked.

 

[Davs]

I'm just going to mention the fact that there were more people playing when many of the features which were removed due to complexity for new people etc were still in place...

Perhaps the features of the game aren't the things contributing to its apparent downfall. I've always believed one of the main factors to be the fact that there are so many people who intentionally try to piss off new players. I know there's no real way to tackle this issue, but by concentrating on advertising you could at least drag in more people (even if only temporarily) until you find your magic, solve-everything solution.

 

[Matthew]

I think bringing people in before the new developments to fix the game will be a good thing. Once they come in and play and almost instantaniously see the admin developing the game and trying to move the game forward in terms of dynamics and balance will make the newbies feel more included within the movement of the game and consider themselves to be more on equal terms with the vets. It could make them more curious about the game and install faith within the games admin etc.

 

[Garrett]

eh unless it's a 'finished' application that you package up and ship to stores... it's never really 'finished'.

at least it shouldn't be. even main support for 'packaged' games lasts for a year or two depending on popularity and reported issues.

so technically Admin should always be looking to 'improve' especially a web based game as web technologies change at the very least. (like could/would affect the portal)

it'd be great if that 'thread' was stickied and updated. or a thread stickied and locked and only azzer made updates. sent him many ideas on how to keep that a recurring, often updated thing.

but to your point... big updates and changes only happen in random spurts and all at once.

Just get people here period should be the main goal, imo. I mean someone offering 200 man pworld. (plus a plethora of BC's purchased to do it?!) Azzer asked to bump it to do the Age 2 stuff. His reponses looked like he had it all planned out when people were questioning the timing... but if any of it was planned out... Age 2 would have been announced, planned for, 200 man pworld not ordered for the same time. So watching and waiting for this and that only makes time pass on while nothing is accomplished, including a customer's want to do a large pworld.

So picking a 'good' point in time to start recruiting is way past available. It just needs to happen, but then again maybe there will be an age 3 world and just postpone doing anything real anytime soon.